2019 Honda Civic Hatchback Sport

[erinh]

Beautiful work of art. Congrats!!! So when is the center channel going in :}.

Ge0

Thanks!

Actually, even though I have no plans for ever adding a center channel, if I had had the extra time and money to have Steve make a place for another Dyn as a center channel location I would have done that. But it would have required a good deal more custom fab work with the HVAC system, defroster and temp sensor all being right there.

[Ge0]

Thanks!

Actually, even though I have no plans for ever adding a center channel, if I had had the extra time and money to have Steve make a place for another Dyn as a center channel location I would have done that. But it would have required a good deal more custom fab work with the HVAC system, defroster and temp sensor all being right there.

I was just harassing you .

I am curious about one thing however. Why did you go with a stand alone sub enclosure vs. integrating it into your car? Is this something you want to remove when you need to go to target or get groceries? Not that it matters to the overall sound. Just curious. I mean you did hack you dash apart and all

Ge0

[dgage]

Yes. He wanted it removable.

[erinh]

^ what he said.

[geolemon]

Really super nice. The use of a CNC in the fabrication process has me drooling and imagining.

I'm loving the research you put in here as well, and the videos...
I happen to own the same exact car, just coming off lease (I'm buying it - I like it that much), and as an old-school old-guy enthusiast and audiophile myself, the effort you put in to support the community here is much appreciated.

I'm going to be taking a different approach in the hatch and front stage for my car, but you have me thinking about midbass now and I'm going to be playing with that. I'm not a "rear fill" kind of guy, and so you have me thinking about dedicating those rear door locations exclusively for midbass support now that you did that deep dive. I may even keep those audiofrog midbasses on my short list as well, 9mm Xmax from a 6" woofer is certainly no joke. Did you do them front and rear?

[mumbles]

I'm not a "rear fill" kind of guy, and so you have me thinking about dedicating those rear door locations exclusively for midbass support now that you did that deep dive.

I was in the same camp as you regarding rear fill, but Steve talked me into it and I'm glad he did! It has to be integrated properly so it doesn't pull the stage towards the rear, but when it is, it actually widens the front stage as odd as it sounds.

[geolemon]

I was in the same camp as you regarding rear fill, but Steve talked me into it and I'm glad he did! It has to be integrated properly so it doesn't pull the stage towards the rear, but when it is, it actually widens the front stage as odd as it sounds.

That's the problem with it. Crossed over low enough it shouldn't be an issue, but the higher in frequency you go, the more multi-speaker-path phase interactions there are - mix that in with the reflections that you already can't avoid from all your glass, plastic - stir that up with your inherently offset seating position - it's a phasing nightmare.

I generally like the concert approach. Not that I don't have exceptions - but I'd advise customers who were self-avowed SQ people, to invest in one good component set up front, rather than split the budget. I'm actually personally also a fan of a lot of electronic stuff that's weird and ethereal, or just has a club beat to it - and I think in all cases, it would be ideal to be able to replicate each of those absolutely wildly different environments - but I'm enough of an imaging audiophile nutcase and geek to acknowledge that's unrealistic without lots of complexity that can be so counterproductive.

I once had a '95 Pathfinder around '99 or '00 (back when they were more mini-truck than minivan substitute) that I did a bit of an experiment with a line array - an intentionally near-field line array. I used the neutral center spot between the headrests rather than my listening headrest specifically because I'm also anal about symmetry - but I literally tied a pencil to a string and drew curved lines down the new doorpanels I was fabricating. I mounted two 5.25" midbass drivers down in the corners, and four 2" full range drivers (I swear they were TangBand from PartsExpress).

The net effect was actually awesome. Eventually I added a super-tweeter in my sail panels that picked up way at 10kHz, just the final octave where the little 2" with their phase plugs rolled off around 12kHz.
But what was most remarkable was both the height and width of the stage - neither of which I'd predicted. I was actually trying to create more direct-to-center primary pathlengths, to dominate the reflected pathlengths. And what I didn't realize that I also did was simulate the way a single version of that 2" speaker would project sound towards you if it were several feet to either side of that actual location. For a cheap system, it was one of the best imaging that I've ever had - especially once I filled in those final 'ting tings' that were a little under-represented initially, with the supertweeters.

Four midbasses in that install - but for all intents and purposes, from the same location - not two front, two rear.

I'm curious when you say "intergrated properly", are you referring to phase alignment (timing), or frequency (crossover)?

[Ge0]

I was in the same camp as you regarding rear fill, but Steve talked me into it and I'm glad he did! It has to be integrated properly so it doesn't pull the stage towards the rear, but when it is, it actually widens the front stage as odd as it sounds.

Enhances the front stage it does...

Ge0

[Ge0]

I'm curious when you say "intergrated properly", are you referring to phase alignment (timing), or frequency (crossover)?

#1) Remove all center information using L-R processing or whatever the latest terminology is today.
#2) Band limit the audio so high frequencies are cut out. Hmm. I don't remember, maybe 2KHz
#3) Delay the rear channels to mimic reflections off the back of a listening room. Start with 20mS and go +/- from there.

The net affect is widening and deepening your sound stage. One you have it dialed in it makes a night and day difference. You need to try it to really understand the psycho-acoustical effect. I've been using this in home and auto for close to 15 years. I stand by it's effectiveness.

Oh, and you don't need to spend a lot of money for rear fill. It is only there to add subtle ambiance. Hell, you could use stock speakers. You just need some processing and a weak amp channel.

Ge0

[Ge0]

I once had a '95 Pathfinder around '99 or '00 (back when they were more mini-truck than minivan substitute) that I did a bit of an experiment with a line array - an intentionally near-field line array. I used the neutral center spot between the headrests rather than my listening headrest specifically because I'm also anal about symmetry - but I literally tied a pencil to a string and drew curved lines down the new doorpanels I was fabricating. I mounted two 5.25" midbass drivers down in the corners, and four 2" full range drivers (I swear they were TangBand from PartsExpress).

The net effect was actually awesome. Eventually I added a super-tweeter in my sail panels that picked up way at 10kHz, just the final octave where the little 2" with their phase plugs rolled off around 12kHz.
But what was most remarkable was both the height and width of the stage - neither of which I'd predicted. I was actually trying to create more direct-to-center primary pathlengths, to dominate the reflected pathlengths. And what I didn't realize that I also did was simulate the way a single version of that 2" speaker would project sound towards you if it were several feet to either side of that actual location. For a cheap system, it was one of the best imaging that I've ever had - especially once I filled in those final 'ting tings' that were a little under-represented initially, with the supertweeters.

Darrin?

Ge0