Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 41

Thread: Sub level and how it effects phase alignment and crossovers

  1. Back To Top    #21

    Re: Sub level and how it effects phase alignment and crossovers

    Quote Originally Posted by ckirocz28 View Post
    Mute one channel of input before the subs are mixed in to get an appropriate level.
    I much prefer to take six db off one or both if a pair off a mono amp... I use two front subs that are timed as one, the phase is nigh on identical to within +/-3 degrees at the listening position, so to match them to the mids I knock em down and adjust both channels delay as one and to get the crossover roughly where the phase is good for all three drivers (basically I lump the two subs in as one because their phase responses are so similar in my cabin at the listening position

  2. Back To Top    #22

    Re: Sub level and how it effects phase alignment and crossovers

    Ooooh ooooh ooooh... so if the picture above is your sub and mids... then your sub is 180 out... however you would need to then adjust delays to get the two aligned, and not nesc in the conventional sense...

    so you can see how the phase traces converge to the points between 20hz down to 120hz...

    so if you put the sub out of phase the origin at 20hz will move down by 180 degrees... then add some delay to the rest of the system and the mids will then go from 20hz to 120hz downwards, and as the wavelengths are getting shorter the 120 will move down by more and you will have way better alignment through the crossover region I have drawn the red line as a guide as to where it should end up so you can see what it will look like and why it will track better through the crossover region

    excuse the red line drawn on the screen of my iPhone 👍🏻


    thats an excellent example of how you can do better sometimes with a polarity inversion and more or less delay...
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	D9F81DC6-B216-49B6-8082-3731C20988DA.jpeg 
Views:	153 
Size:	317.7 KB 
ID:	15068  

  3. Back To Top    #23

    Re: Sub level and how it effects phase alignment and crossovers

    Ideally you could remove delay from the sub, but if there is no delay on it you can then add delay to the midbass if that makes sense as it’s the exact same thing

  4. Back To Top    #24
    Noob Jdunk54nl's Avatar
    Real Name
    Jacob
    Location
    Phoenix
    Vehicle
    2014 F150 Limited
    Posts
    1,055
    Join Date
    Oct 2019

    Re: Sub level and how it effects phase alignment and crossovers

    Quote Originally Posted by dumdum View Post
    Smaart di2 which is a stripped down version of 8 with only two inputs and one transfer function at a time

    i use a focusrite 2i2 and a Dayton mic currently, although I am considering an earthworks m23
    Ya, I am thinking a dayton mic to start out (maybe calibrated from cross spectrum if they are actually in stock as it shows out of stock right now) and either the focusrite 4i4 or the motu m4, leaning towards the motu m4 but they are out of stock everywhere. So might fall back on the focusrite. The motu measures (not that it is audible) better than the focusrite and I like the look better.
    Last edited by Jdunk54nl; 01-08-2021 at 09:24 AM.
    2014 F150 Limited -> Kenwood DDX-9907xr -> Helix DSP.2 -> Alpine PDX-V9 -> SI M25 mki in Valicar Stuttgart Pods, Rear SB17's, Sub SI BM MKV's in MTI BOX. Alpine PDX-F6 -> SI Tm65 mkIV, SI M3 mkI in Valicar Stuttgart Pods

  5. Back To Top    #25

    Re: Sub level and how it effects phase alignment and crossovers

    Quote Originally Posted by Jdunk54nl View Post
    Ya, I am thinking a dayton mic to start out (maybe calibrated from cross spectrum if they are actually in stock as it shows out of stock right now) and either the focusrite 4i4 or the motu m4, leaning towards the motu m4.
    Good mic to start with... I use one currently until the new mic arrives... but point it up so it’s tip is between the ears and the mic is at right angles to the plain of tip to both speakers... otherwise you get way more level from the drivers side and way less from the passenger side... it matches the polar response and puts both drivers at 90 degrees to the tip and not 15 degrees and 50 degrees if you point it forwards

    I have a little jig Ive made that just hooks over the headrest legs and sits on, it means I can tune outside the car, jump in, move the mic, then put it back in the exact same place and tune a bit more, very simple, but works exceedingly well!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	CC264C09-BFEE-4F59-A15B-16A141ADB29F.jpg 
Views:	148 
Size:	59.1 KB 
ID:	15069   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	D3FAC8BD-AD92-4C2D-A877-735EA2B93229.jpg 
Views:	146 
Size:	53.1 KB 
ID:	15070   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	1C8ED50B-63D6-49F3-9EC6-D0309AA0E782.jpg 
Views:	151 
Size:	51.0 KB 
ID:	15071  

  6. Back To Top    #26

    Re: Sub level and how it effects phase alignment and crossovers

    Quote Originally Posted by Jdunk54nl View Post
    Ya, I am thinking a dayton mic to start out (maybe calibrated from cross spectrum if they are actually in stock as it shows out of stock right now) and either the focusrite 4i4 or the motu m4, leaning towards the motu m4.
    Good mic to start with... I use one currently until the new mic arrives with a focusrite 2i2... but point it up so it’s tip is between the ears and the mic is at right angles to the plain of tip to both speakers... otherwise you get way more level from the drivers side and way less from the passenger side... it matches the polar response and puts both drivers at 90 degrees to the tip and not 15 degrees and 50 degrees if you point it forwards

    I have a little jig Ive made that just hooks over the headrest legs and sits on, it means I can tune outside the car, jump in, move the mic, then put it back in the exact same place and tune a bit more, very simple, but works exceedingly well!

  7. Back To Top    #27

    Re: Sub level and how it effects phase alignment and crossovers

    Quote Originally Posted by dumdum View Post
    I much prefer to take six db off one or both if a pair off a mono amp... I use two front subs that are timed as one, the phase is nigh on identical to within +/-3 degrees at the listening position, so to match them to the mids I knock em down and adjust both channels delay as one and to get the crossover roughly where the phase is good for all three drivers (basically I lump the two subs in as one because their phase responses are so similar in my cabin at the listening position
    If they are fed a L+R signal, and the test tone is mono, simply cutting one channel of input is quite easy, mute, measure, then unmute.

  8. Back To Top    #28
    Noob Jdunk54nl's Avatar
    Real Name
    Jacob
    Location
    Phoenix
    Vehicle
    2014 F150 Limited
    Posts
    1,055
    Join Date
    Oct 2019

    Re: Sub level and how it effects phase alignment and crossovers

    Quote Originally Posted by ckirocz28 View Post
    If they are fed a L+R signal, and the test tone is mono, simply cutting one channel of input is quite easy, mute, measure, then unmute.
    Unless your channels are linked and unlinking/linking messes things up depending on order of what you press (Dayton 408 in this case). Trust me not worth that. Easier to just cut 6 for me. I just forgot to do it in those measurements when I was playing with rew’s phase stuff.
    2014 F150 Limited -> Kenwood DDX-9907xr -> Helix DSP.2 -> Alpine PDX-V9 -> SI M25 mki in Valicar Stuttgart Pods, Rear SB17's, Sub SI BM MKV's in MTI BOX. Alpine PDX-F6 -> SI Tm65 mkIV, SI M3 mkI in Valicar Stuttgart Pods

  9. Back To Top    #29

    Re: Sub level and how it effects phase alignment and crossovers

    Quote Originally Posted by Jdunk54nl View Post
    Unless your channels are linked and unlinking/linking messes things up depending on order of what you press (Dayton 408 in this case). Trust me not worth that. Easier to just cut 6 for me. I just forgot to do it in those measurements when I was playing with rew’s phase stuff.
    You can't just mute one channel of the input without messing up something? I am talking about the input side of the dsp.

  10. Back To Top    #30
    Noob Jdunk54nl's Avatar
    Real Name
    Jacob
    Location
    Phoenix
    Vehicle
    2014 F150 Limited
    Posts
    1,055
    Join Date
    Oct 2019

    Re: Sub level and how it effects phase alignment and crossovers

    Quote Originally Posted by ckirocz28 View Post
    You can't just mute one channel of the input without messing up something? I am talking about the input side of the dsp.
    Fair enough. You can. It might mess with things though if using a factory HU compared to just cutting -6 depending on factory EQ stuff.
    2014 F150 Limited -> Kenwood DDX-9907xr -> Helix DSP.2 -> Alpine PDX-V9 -> SI M25 mki in Valicar Stuttgart Pods, Rear SB17's, Sub SI BM MKV's in MTI BOX. Alpine PDX-F6 -> SI Tm65 mkIV, SI M3 mkI in Valicar Stuttgart Pods

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Back To Top