Narrowing down the midbass to a few.

[geolemon]

I've been driving a Civic sport hatchback lease - the turn-in period happened after Covid started so that was in limbo for a couple extra months, but I finally took the bull by the horns - I called them and mailed in a check. Now it's mine. I love the car, it's light, quick, fun, and has a huge and practical cargo area for anything. So after three years of subconscious planning, I have a plan for the audio system and have only just started, here.

I have plenty of subs - I'm taking advantage of a cavernous spot in the rear corner for a single sub.
Front stage is still being experimented with in a little lab in my basement (what, you don't have a windshield and faux-dashboard suspended to play with acoustics in the fall/winter months?), but I'm fairly certain it's going to use my favorite Focal TN52 tweeters I already have. Although I'm still experimenting with alignments, I'm also fairly certain that I'm going to use some wideband drivers up in that dashboard area that I'm playing with in my mock-up.
I have until summer to figure that out - it'll be the last part I tackle.

That leaves the midbass to tackle next.

Here were the original seven that I had been collecting on my list - these are all noteworthy for different reasons:

Midbass driver	Ohms	Sensitivity	Qts	Fs hz	Xmax mm	Watts	price	reputation	prestige	data/notes	compare criteria:
Dayton RS-180 reference	4	89.20	0.46	38.4	6	60	$49.45	high	low	test bench
Peerless SLS	4	82.00	0.35	42	8.2	75	$53.07	high	medium		only for sub-1khz
GR Research M165X	8	88.30	0.44	40	7.8	unk	$45.00	medium	medium	M-165X (XBL)	XBL
Exodus Anarchy	4	86.50	0.44	45.8	12.5	100	$66.00	medium	low	test bench (XBL)	XBL
ScanSpeak revelator	4	90.00	0.35	33	6.5	60	$209.00	high	med-high	18W8531G	expensive
ScanSpeak discovery	4	91.50	0.35	47	4.3	55	$71.00	medium	medium		middling
SSA Evil 6.5	4	89.90	0.47	65.5	6	125	$52.99	medium	low	underhung, shorting ring

Here was my basic logic on the eliminations:

• The Peerless SLS is a great dedicated midbass - but really truly can't play over 600hz or so. I may always experiment with my front stage, that really limits the use to midbass only.
• M165X - what a bang for the buck. But, it's 8 ohms and only on here because I am a former XBL^2 licensee... and always wanted to try an XBL mid. The Exodus Anarchy is that, too.
• ScanSpeak Revelator. Legendary. Nothing to criticize, other than quadrupling the expense compared to the others - justifiable if I were using it in a 2-way, not so much for a 3-way.
• ScanSpeak Discovery. Less legendary, so less appealing. Also-ran, nothing outstanding about it, not used in high-end OEM, and still more expensive than the others left standing.

That leaves three finalists:

Midbass driver	Ohms	Sensitivity	Qts	Fs hz	Xmax mm	Watts	price	reputation	prestige	data/notes
Dayton RS-180 reference	4	89.20	0.46	38.4	6	60	$49.45	high	low	test bench
Exodus Anarchy	4	86.50	0.44	45.8	12.5	100	$66.00	medium	low	test bench (XBL)
SSA Evil 6.5	4	89.90	0.47	65.5	6	125	$52.99	medium	low	bells and whistles

• Exodus Anarchy - As mentioned above, as a former XBL^2 licensee, I worked with Adire back in the day to design some subs - but never heard XBL in a mid. XBL makes for a flat-BL curve and reduction of intermodulation distortion, which should benefit a midbass too. And look at that excursion. That will help it play as low as 45hz if I needed it to, without bottoming. That's subwoofer Xmax, way more than will ever be needed.
• SSA Evil 6.5 - Underhung motor is a bit like XBL^2 to a lesser degree - gives a flatter BL curve. This has that. And an extended pole piece to balance the BL curve, even forming a phase plug to help extend response up high a bit more. Has a shorting ring to also flatten the BL curve and reduce inductance. And a bunch of other bells and whistles inside and outside. The con at this price would be a 65hz Fs, but I shouldn't need to extend that low. 6mm Xmax is still slightly above average for midbasses, so that's not a con - plenty of throw for even loud listening.
• Dayton RS-180 - lowest price, nearly the best specs, are used in some high-end speaker kits and even some boutique OEM four-figure speakers. It also has a shorting ring, and some of the fancy features you find on higher end drivers. Dayton Reference are well known, but Dayton being "Parts Express house brand" has so little prestige, it has that fun "sleeper factor"... but only in an impressive sounding install.

Curious to hear thoughts on these... or ones I dismissed.

[geolemon]

Oh, I forgot to mention one more interesting quirk that also factors into the selection...

I just took my care for the first rust-kote appointment. I live in Buffalo, we have snow, they salt the roads. So this is a very thorough oil mist/spray that they treat the bottom of the car with, seasonally. They also drill into cavities and mist into those - including the door cavities. Then, they install plugs to seal the cavities back up.

Now, if I'd been thinking when I dropped the car off, I would have told them not to do that this year - just imagine what a pain it's going to be for me to install damping materials and CCF the inside of the doors. Good thing I already own two cans of parts cleaner solvent...
But, eventually I do want them to do the whole treatment.

Normally, I'm a fan of just doing a good baffle on the inner door surface, and running my midbass that way. And I suppose, that's still an option. I just don't know how much of an oil mist goes in there - it's another good reason not to go too exotic with my speakers perhaps. Although also - worst case it'll add a little mass, if any oil actually clings to the speaker - probably not even enough to shift the Fs.

But I'm thinking it might be smart to actually build enclosures to go inside the doors. I don't know if any of you are Hexibase subscribers on YouTube, but I also own a 3D printer, and might be interesting to print up some enclosures that could attach from the inside. I even have four ScanSpeak Variovents that might be good to fire into the door cavity, which also have a flattening effect on the speaker impedence. Of course - I also don't know how those would do with an oil mist - but hey.

So there's a little extra to add to the consideration.
Possibly much ado about nothing - the positive side of already having this treatment done to my car, is that now when I take my door panels off, I will see whether that mist has completely coated my factory speakers, or if it's really no big deal.

[chithead]

That ^^^ Would be awesome. 3D printed midbass enclosures? Uhhh, yes please. That definitely opens up the possibilities far as woofer selection goes too. Won't be restrained to mobile only choices due to weather conditions.

[Jscoyne2]

Idk if you have looked at Satori but i was EXTREMELY impressed by the midrange version of this driver. This is the midbass version.

https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.co...-woofer-4-ohm/

https://www.erinsaudiocorner.com/dri...atori_mw13p-4/

If you do go the Ssa Evil way. I would be interested in your thoughts. I've always considered SSA Subs to be highly underrated and slept on. Good company. Smart engineer.

[Jdunk54nl]

I run the peerless sls in my doors. They are awesome and can play low. Mine are actually fairly flat from 20hz to 100hz then a bump after that.

I would not use these if I needed anything over 500hz. They just can't do it and were not designed to do it. But if you can cross under 500hz, they would be my choice for sure. $100 for a pair of awesome midbass monsters. I have them on my pdx-f6 amp so ~170 watts possible going to them (granted with anything this is substantially less with actual music) and they don't complain.


Justin Zazzi also uses the peerless in his doors, it was on his recommendation to try them. I had the SI tm65 mkiii's but they had a manufacturing defect and now waiting for the mkiv's to be out to get my replacement set. But after the peerless....I don't know if I want to change them out...They are that good.

[Dakine_surf]

I have a set of the Peerless that I got from Ge0... I haven't had a chance to try them in a set of doors, but I did throw them on the bench really quickly and I was pretty impressed.

For the price they are going to be hard to beat.

[geolemon]

Trust me, it was painful, in a way, to pull the SDS off the list of finalists. Same with the Revelators. In both cases, I have absolutely the most reputable reviewers who have loved these speakers. That gives me the most confidence that these would at least not be disappointing, when I power them up.

"The" problem with this is: I'm not going to be able to pick speakers with my own ears - a car audio sin by my own car audio moral code. Especially for component sets, I ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS tell people "Let your ears decide! You might be surprised!".

Granted - down low, especially with subwoofers and bass, you can rely more on predictable science and engineering that makes sub shopping relatively easy/fun/low-risk.
As you go higher and wavelengths get shorter, there's so many more details of acoustics that are related to subtleties, materials, even manufacturing details - even the car itself. By the time you start talking about "imaging", you are in the world of psychoacoustics, where "accurate reproduction without distortion" is only the starting point.

So for midbass - it's likely that I will only end up using them below 500hz.
...but since I'll have the opportunity to tune this with DSP, and since my front stage is very likely going to be comprised of 3" or even 2" wideband drivers, there's a distinct possibility that I might need to run them up a bit higher. So that rules out the SLS.

And as for the Revelators - well, even though they are known-greats, four of them will cost nearly a grand, once tax and shipping are factored in. That's not "purchase sight unseen" money.

I want to have the confidence that if something doesn't work out, doesn't suit the install - they'll be essentially disposable. And really, it's more fun when you have bang-for-the-buck bragging rights. It is still painful, because both of the above definitely fall into the category of "known good" woofers. More so than the remaining three on my list!

[geolemon]

Also, for the remaining three - they are distinctly different, which is why i'm undecided. That means they don't really fall into the usual "Any of those is as good as the other - just throw a dart!" discussion.
The prices are as near to equal as matters. So the differences are these, fundamentally:

• Dayton RS-180 - the most traditional woofer. Overhung motor. Traditional design. Simply great specs. OEM and kit makers lend credence to positive rave reviewers.

• Exodus Anarchy - the least traditional woofer. XBL^2 balanced split-gap, flat-BL motor, and suspension. The test bench link may show some manufacturing inconsistencies from those Klippel curves though - not a perfect centering of either. Still should be less IM distortion than an overhung design - and look at that Xmax. But - few reviews mean few clues on the sound. Would have to take a chance and hear how they sound, but excursion sure won't be the limiting factor here.

• SSA Evil 6.5 - Underhung motor is not entirely nontraditional. It gives a flatter BL curve than the Dayton - and that Klippel test bench shows it isn't even too far off the Anarchy. The extended pole piece that also serves as a phase plug, the shorting ring - and so many other details that just look higher quality than the price tag would suggest. But also - few reviews, going to have to take a chance. 6mm Xmax is OK, but on par with the traditional RS-180, which could be said to have better specs in other areas. This is VERY shallow for an underhung driver - check out the 6.5" Tang Band underhung driver on Parts Express website . Underhung drivers NEED a huge top plate, so I wonder how thin the magnet is to achieve the very normal mounting depth. That could mean very little rear clearance for overexcursion - that 6mm Xmax could also mean 6mm Xmech... but again, I don't know that.

Tough choice.

EDIT: Did I mention the SSA Evil aren't in stock currently?
Also - not to judge a book by a cover, but "Evil" isn't the sort of name that I usually associate with audiophile drivers... not that it means anything, but does give me pause on the demographic they were designing these for. I hate to have 'things that shouldn't matter' planting a seed of doubt in my consideration. Like the other two - if only I could hear them.

[geolemon]

Idk if you have looked at Satori but i was EXTREMELY impressed by the midrange version of this driver. This is the midbass version.

https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.co...-woofer-4-ohm/

https://www.erinsaudiocorner.com/dri...atori_mw13p-4/

If you do go the Ssa Evil way. I would be interested in your thoughts. I've always considered SSA Subs to be highly underrated and slept on. Good company. Smart engineer.

Lots of info on those 5.25's that would likely bode well for the 6.5's as well. The price seems right on those - rave reviews and tests, less reputation than the Revelators, and a price that reflects both.

I'm a big fan of Erin - his Civic is exactly the same as mine, although like I said, I'm not going to necessarily go his route on the front stage. Doing some experimenting in an indoor mockup over the winter.

[Jscoyne2]

Imo, i would get your midrange and tweeter installed and FR swept. See where your x/o needs to be and then decide on a midbass.

Might open the Sls that way. Also the satori have midbass in like 7 and 8in drivers as wl