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Thread: Justin Zazzi's tuning companion for room eq wizard

  1. Back To Top    #71
    Noob Cathul's Avatar
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    Re: Justin Zazzi's tuning companion for room eq wizard

    My question would be, if it's an overlap electrically, or acoustically?
    If electrically, it doesn't really matter if the acoustical targets are met.
    F.e. with my current setup i overlap my midrange and tweeters quite a bit, but acoustically they meet the target lines.
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  2. Back To Top    #72
    Wave Shepherd - aka Jazzi Justin Zazzi's Avatar
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    Re: Justin Zazzi's tuning companion for room eq wizard

    Yes the formulas will work, like Jdunk says.

    However your results might be strange.

    I am also curious why you prefer to over/underlap the frequencies. What are you hoping to accomplish?
    Measure with mics, mark with chalk, cut with torch, grind to fit, sand to finish, paint to match.
    Updated Justin tuning sheet (Justin and Erica tuning companion for SMAART and REW)
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  3. Back To Top    #73

    Re: Justin Zazzi's tuning companion for room eq wizard

    My midbass capable of playing down to 40hz. I find it sounds more pleasant overlap the midbass and sub. Also more of authentic sub upfront sound.

  4. Back To Top    #74
    Noob Jdunk54nl's Avatar
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    Re: Justin Zazzi's tuning companion for room eq wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by Kb86 View Post
    My midbass capable of playing down to 40hz. I find it sounds more pleasant overlap the midbass and sub. Also more of authentic sub upfront sound.
    Can you post some measurements of this? Just curious as to what measurements are showing.
    2014 F150 Limited -> Kenwood DDX-9907xr -> Helix DSP.2 -> Alpine PDX-V9 -> SI M25 mki in Valicar Stuttgart Pods, Rear SB17's, Sub SI BM MKV's in MTI BOX. Alpine PDX-F6 -> SI Tm65 mkIV, SI M3 mkI in Valicar Stuttgart Pods

  5. Back To Top    #75

    Re: Justin Zazzi's tuning companion for room eq wizard

    REW Settings?

    Sorry if this has been documented somewhere - if so, please just send me the link. Here's what I am trying to do and my questions:

    * Tweeter 24db LW from 3000 on up
    * Midrange 24db LW 300 to 3000
    * Midbass 24db LW 80 to 300
    * Sub 24db LW up to 80
    * using Jazzi'sTarget curve

    1) RTA settings - 1/3 or 1/6 octave,smoothing, anything else?
    2) EQ settings -
    a. Equalizer - I'm guessing Generic - I'm using a Mosconi DSP.
    b. Target type - I think I saw "None" was recommeneded - is that correct?
    c. Based upon Target type, any other settings that need changing?
    4) Filter tasks - what's the recommendation for the Match Range? Boost options? Flatness curve? Let's take my midrange (300-3000 LW) for example.

    Thanks,
    Dave

  6. Back To Top    #76
    Wave Shepherd - aka Jazzi Justin Zazzi's Avatar
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    Re: Justin Zazzi's tuning companion for room eq wizard

    With this technique:
    -single microphone, either USB or XLR
    -moving spatial average (wave microphone around by hand)
    -at listening position (near driver's headrest)
    -playing noise from REW or the wav file it produces

    I like to use these settings on the generator:
    -noise
    -periodic pink noise
    -full range
    -sequence length 16k
    -level -12dBFS RMS

    Then (and only then) you can use these settings on the RTA window:
    -mode 1/48th octave
    -smoothing none
    -fft length 16k (match the generator!)
    -averages forever, while you wave the mic around
    -window rectangular (only works for periodic noise if sequence and FFT lengths both match)
    -max overlap 0%

    To take a measurement:
    -play noise in a loop either from REW's generator or the wav file it can create
    -turn on the RTA by pressing the red record button
    -wave microphone around the listening position slowly
    -press the "reset averaging" button on the RTA window
    -continue waving microphone around the listening postion
    -wait until the RTA trace settles and stops changing a lot
    (this is usually 10-20 averages or more)
    -press the red record button to stop the RTA
    -stop playing the noise
    -on RTA screen, press save "current" trace

    Finally, apply the smoothing you want:
    -on the main REW screen, go to the "all traces" tab
    -select all of the traces you've measured above
    -open settings by pressing the gear icon
    -change smoothing to 1/3rd-octave
    -press apply smoothing
    (experiment with other smoothing if you wish, I like 1/3rd or 1/6th sometimes)



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    Measure with mics, mark with chalk, cut with torch, grind to fit, sand to finish, paint to match.
    Updated Justin tuning sheet (Justin and Erica tuning companion for SMAART and REW)
    Do it for them.

  7. Back To Top    #77
    Wave Shepherd - aka Jazzi Justin Zazzi's Avatar
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    Re: Justin Zazzi's tuning companion for room eq wizard

    When you want to use the EQ window, try this. Load the house curve for the overall shape that you want to use. My spreadsheet will create a file that is named "REW_Curve_something_overall.txt". Use that one in the REW house curve selection.

    Then go to the EQ page within REW and try these settings:
    -target settings
    -target type, speaker driver
    -crossover HP cutoff (Hz), 80
    -crossover HP type, LR4
    -crossover LP cutoff (HZ), 300
    -crossover LP type, LR4

    This should create a target for your midbass speakers. Then adjust the highpass and lowpass type and frequency to adjust the target for your subwoofer and your dash speakers. This is a very similar process to using the individual text files that the spreadsheet creates, but it takes a little less clicking. Thanks to jdunkl and others who helped discover this trick.

    I cannot help you much with the auto eq settings like filter tasks, match range, max boost, etc. I do not use the auto feature and don't have much intuition with what settings work well. I strongly encourage you to try creating filters yourself, if you are comfortable trying it. Just keep the Q values around 0.5 to 3.0 and you'll avoid chasing your tail too much.


    Click image for larger version. 

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    Measure with mics, mark with chalk, cut with torch, grind to fit, sand to finish, paint to match.
    Updated Justin tuning sheet (Justin and Erica tuning companion for SMAART and REW)
    Do it for them.

  8. Back To Top    #78
    Noob Jdunk54nl's Avatar
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    Re: Justin Zazzi's tuning companion for room eq wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Zazzi View Post
    When you want to use the EQ window, try this. Load the house curve for the overall shape that you want to use. My spreadsheet will create a file that is named "REW_Curve_something_overall.txt". Use that one in the REW house curve selection.

    Then go to the EQ page within REW and try these settings:
    -target settings
    -target type, speaker driver
    -crossover HP cutoff (Hz), 80
    -crossover HP type, LR4
    -crossover LP cutoff (HZ), 300
    -crossover LP type, LR4

    This should create a target for your midbass speakers. Then adjust the highpass and lowpass type and frequency to adjust the target for your subwoofer and your dash speakers. This is a very similar process to using the individual text files that the spreadsheet creates, but it takes a little less clicking. Thanks to jdunkl and others who helped discover this trick.

    I cannot help you much with the auto eq settings like filter tasks, match range, max boost, etc. I do not use the auto feature and don't have much intuition with what settings work well. I strongly encourage you to try creating filters yourself, if you are comfortable trying it. Just keep the Q values around 0.5 to 3.0 and you'll avoid chasing your tail too much.


    Click image for larger version. 

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    I really do love that feature in REW. SO glad they added it. Saves a lot of files being generated and then having to constantly change the house curve each time you change what driver or where you want crossovers placed.
    2014 F150 Limited -> Kenwood DDX-9907xr -> Helix DSP.2 -> Alpine PDX-V9 -> SI M25 mki in Valicar Stuttgart Pods, Rear SB17's, Sub SI BM MKV's in MTI BOX. Alpine PDX-F6 -> SI Tm65 mkIV, SI M3 mkI in Valicar Stuttgart Pods

  9. Back To Top    #79

    Re: Justin Zazzi's tuning companion for room eq wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Zazzi View Post
    Finally, apply the smoothing you want:
    -on the main REW screen, go to the "all traces" tab
    -select all of the traces you've measured above
    -open settings by pressing the gear icon
    -change smoothing to 1/3rd-octave
    -press apply smoothing
    (experiment with other smoothing if you wish, I like 1/3rd or 1/6th sometimes)
    Two items:

    1) The above part of your post is the part I don't understand. I don't see an "all traces" tab on my main REW screen??

    2) You didn't mention it, but I'm guessing that you do the left and right channels separately? And the sub as well?

    Thanks,
    Dave

  10. Back To Top    #80
    Wave Shepherd - aka Jazzi Justin Zazzi's Avatar
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    Re: Justin Zazzi's tuning companion for room eq wizard

    Quote Originally Posted by thezaks View Post
    Two items:

    1) The above part of your post is the part I don't understand. I don't see an "all traces" tab on my main REW screen??

    2) You didn't mention it, but I'm guessing that you do the left and right channels separately? And the sub as well?

    Thanks,
    Dave
    Oops, I meant to say "All SPL". See screenshot below.

    I like to do one channel at a time for all the frequency response steps. By unique, I mean basically once for each RCA cable or once for each DSP output channel. Sometimes this is once per actual speaker, or once per quadrant if you have a passive crossover 2-way in the front left, etc.



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    Measure with mics, mark with chalk, cut with torch, grind to fit, sand to finish, paint to match.
    Updated Justin tuning sheet (Justin and Erica tuning companion for SMAART and REW)
    Do it for them.

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