Use your subwoofer to get better midbass

[erinh]

First, thank you for the very helpful video. i did a few quick adjustments on my lunch break and noticed a marked improvement in the midbass response.

Second, you mention how the near side null sounds like the sound is localized to the driver that has the null and also contributes to the subwoofer localizing to the rear instead of blending with the front. my question is do similar problems happen at higher frequencies? One thing I have noticed in my car is that sometimes I will hear some guitar notes and some hand drum notes that pull either straight back or to one of the rear corners even though the only driver in the rear is my sub. Is this effect somehow also phase related or are other there other potential things like reflections or? that could cause what would call a phantom speaker to momentarily grab your attention to an area where no physical driver is located?

Absolutely. Fun trick: mute all speakers. Now, un-mute a single speaker (doesn't matter which one). Now play a sine sweep through that single speaker. Listen how the sound will move from one side of the car to the other. It's a trip. But it's acoustics. If it can happen with one tweeter playing, it can happen with any combination of speakers playing.

[erinh]

On the sub common sense tells me that sub choice is crucial to doing what you suggest. I can think of a lot of badass subs that are popular but struggle to play cleanly much above 60hz. It's really hard to have your cake and eat it too in that category. So a lot of people are most likely crossing midbass lower than they should because the sub can't play high enough to give a sufficient overlap and speaker limits. No different from crossing a 6.5" mid in doors to most tweeters where both speakers are playing to the ragged edge of their limits.

I honestly don't really notice this being the case. Not unless they're really long throw with high/assymetric inductance curves. IMHO, people simply cross low because they *think* (understandably) that will make the bass come from up front. But that's why I made this video: to show that's not always true.

[mlekk]

Continuing to explore can only help ?

[Jdunk54nl]

A lot of what Erin has said, I confirmed in my truck a few months ago. I didn't realize all of the stuff he said in the video, but it makes a lot of sense on the results I am seeing on my midbass speakers (Drop off at like 100hz) and subs. I have since switched sub setup, but this was my result with a single sub in a crew cab 2014 F150.


Note: This has a 80hz low pass on it to get an acoustical crossover of 100hz between subs and midbass.

I was trying various locations to see if they made a difference. By Ear, passenger side was the best and down firing seemed better but I wasn't 100% sure. So, I decided to take some measurements and find out.

Here are those measurements. If you have a single sub, definitely place it on the passenger side and down firing if you can! DO NOT PLACE IT ON THE DRIVERS SIDE!!!!!

This is all 6 different possibilities:





This is my before (center up firing) to my now (passenger side down firing). Gained 3db which is equivalent to doubling the power or adding a second speaker (not both)






This is passenger side up vs. down

[erinh]

Very interesting. All of your downfiring have less output by about 3dB. Wouldn't have guessed it would make that much of a difference. Good info!

[Jdunk54nl]

Reverse that, up firing have about 3db less.

[blockrocker]

Is that a sealed box, jdunk? I'm assuming yes, but just want to clarify. Great info.

[Jdunk54nl]

It was. It was this one to be specific. To down fire it, I just placed some 2x4's under the edge. I didn't want to buy/build a new box if I didn't get good results. I was also looking to get an MTI box. and wanted to know how I should have them build it. Needless to say, I did a down fire design.

https://www.jlaudio.com/collections/...-systems-93302

[erinh]

Reverse that, up firing have about 3db less.

Yep. Got my words crossed.

[Hillbilly SQ]

Believe it or not forward firing into the passenger seat of my single cab truck works better than downfiring behind the passenger seat. Sub was giving me fits so decided to do some experimenting. I did it by ear so can't say which way measured better but forward firing into the seat was enough of an audible difference that I will never downfire again in this truck.