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Thread: The "Share your tune measurements and methods" thread

  1. Back To Top    #21
    BURNED OUT Hillbilly SQ's Avatar
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    Re: The "Share your tune measurements and methods" thread

    Well, all the cool kids seem to tune without a body in the seat so there's that (sarcasm). I'm not one of the cool kids so I tune with my stocky body in the seat (sarcasm again but everything after this is sincere). I've never measured with and without me in the seat but there's no way a human body ISN'T throwing things off at least a little. Maybe it's not such a big deal if you're running dedicated midbass speakers with midrange and tweets up high? Even when I had a back seat I tuned sitting in the drivers seat and it works for me. I'm sure someone could put their fancy 5 mic tuning rig in there with fancy software and blow my mind with a truly professional tune but don't have a friend who's a tuning prodigy in easy reach and not gonna pay someone to tune something that's just a casual hobby for me. Maybe if I took this more seriously I'd get a professional tune from someone with a good track record just to compare it against my own that's already been said to be pretty damn good for being done by someone with questionable hearing (up for debate and it varies depending on allergies and if I remembered to flush out earwax BEFORE doing the by ear stuff).

    EDIT: If I can get off the lake long enough while on vacation and the dogs are quiet (preferably in the house sleeping) I might do a new tune and share it here. Maybe I will, maybe I won't, lol.
    Last edited by Hillbilly SQ; 1 Week Ago at 06:11 PM.
    In the hobby of car audio screwing up from time to time comes with the territory. How you move forward afterwards will determine if you can laugh about it or be furious. Life's too short to be mad so get glad

  2. Back To Top    #22

    Re: The "Share your tune measurements and methods" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Hillbilly SQ View Post
    Well, all the cool kids seem to tune without a body in the seat so there's that (sarcasm). I'm not one of the cool kids so I tune with my stocky body in the seat (sarcasm again but everything after this is sincere).

    Who are these cool kids you're (sarcastically) speaking of?

    Don't be shy. Speak what's on your mind.
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  3. Back To Top    #23
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    Re: The "Share your tune measurements and methods" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by erinh View Post
    Who are these cool kids you're (sarcastically) speaking of?

    Don't be shy. Speak what's on your mind.
    Anyone who tunes without their butt in the seat. I'm too lazy to do all that
    In the hobby of car audio screwing up from time to time comes with the territory. How you move forward afterwards will determine if you can laugh about it or be furious. Life's too short to be mad so get glad

  4. Back To Top    #24

    Re: The "Share your tune measurements and methods" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Hillbilly SQ View Post
    Anyone who tunes without their butt in the seat. I'm too lazy to do all that
    ahhh. I have done it all. No one method works. Best to use a mix. No matter your skill level.
    -- SQ is great, but sometimes nostalgia is greater. --


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  5. Back To Top    #25

    Re: The "Share your tune measurements and methods" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Hillbilly SQ View Post
    Anyone who tunes without their butt in the seat. I'm too lazy to do all that
    Haha I'm too lazy to tune in the driver's seat! I like the backseat. There's more room, I can layout the computer and sound card and not get tangled, I can fold down the seats and layout pillows and blankets and bring the dog in to keep my company. I've been known to build a fort back there instead of sit in the driver's seat haha.
    Measure with mics, mark with chalk, cut with torch, grind to fit, sand to finish, paint to match.

  6. Back To Top    #26
    BURNED OUT Hillbilly SQ's Avatar
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    Re: The "Share your tune measurements and methods" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Zazzi View Post
    Haha I'm too lazy to tune in the driver's seat! I like the backseat. There's more room, I can layout the computer and sound card and not get tangled, I can fold down the seats and layout pillows and blankets and bring the dog in to keep my company. I've been known to build a fort back there instead of sit in the driver's seat haha.
    lol you're welcome to try to tune from the back seat of my single cab truckNot an ideal platform for an SQ system but I love that wide and stubby thing and need the open bed. My dog doesn't like being confined so she'd go nuts. Lab, Daschund, and Pit Bull from what we can see in her and who the hell knows what else. And solid black. She's obedient at least.
    In the hobby of car audio screwing up from time to time comes with the territory. How you move forward afterwards will determine if you can laugh about it or be furious. Life's too short to be mad so get glad

  7. Back To Top    #27

    Re: The "Share your tune measurements and methods" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Zazzi View Post
    Haha I'm too lazy to tune in the driver's seat! I like the backseat. There's more room, I can layout the computer and sound card and not get tangled, I can fold down the seats and layout pillows and blankets and bring the dog in to keep my company. I've been known to build a fort back there instead of sit in the driver's seat haha.
    Hahaha. I may need to try this. Are you waving the microphone around by hand (reaching into the space where your head would be) or do you use a rig? Thanks!


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  8. Back To Top    #28

    Re: The "Share your tune measurements and methods" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Zazzi View Post
    Haha I'm too lazy to tune in the driver's seat! I like the backseat. There's more room, I can layout the computer and sound card and not get tangled, I can fold down the seats and layout pillows and blankets and bring the dog in to keep my company. I've been known to build a fort back there instead of sit in the driver's seat haha.
    yawn. let me know when you start driving from the back seat, too.
    -- SQ is great, but sometimes nostalgia is greater. --


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  9. Back To Top    #29

    Re: The "Share your tune measurements and methods" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by jtrosky View Post
    I'd be really curious to see how your L+R speaker pair measurements and the overall measurement looks compared to your individual speaker responses, if you happen to get the time to take them.

    I was kind of surprised to see
    a) how different the dB increase was when playing L+R midbass vs. L+R dash speakers (my midbass speaker pairs gained about 6dB compared to individual speaker dB levels, but my mid/high speaker pairs only gained about 3dB when L+R speaker pairs are played)

    and

    b) how certain areas of the L+R responses didn't match the shape of the individual speaker responses - I had quite a few phase- or reflection-induced dips when playing L+R speaker pairs - which I then had to address as another whole round of EQ corrections. Then I had to do yet another round of EQ when all speakers were playing. The end result is that my individual speaker responses no longer matched the curve by the time I was done (but the overall response did). :-)

    A few other things I recently noticed that surprised me a little:

    1. When adding my rear speakers to the overall measurement, it didn't just make the overall response louder in the freq range that the rear speakers play - it actually changed the *shape* of the response quite a bit.
    2. How much the overall response changed when I changed the delay time for the rear speakers. Using a delay of 10ms looked very different than when using a delay of 20ms, for example.
    3. The change in response if I had my windows cracked just 1/2"! It caused areas of the bass response to lose a few dBs!
    4. How different the response looked with relatively minor temperature/humidity changes - mainly with frequencies above ~2khz.

    I'll be posting step-by-step measurements as I go through the entire process shortly.

    I've never used separate target curves for each individual speaker before - I just let REW figure out the individual speaker curves from the overall target curve since it basically just "creates" the individual speaker curves from the overall curve automatically "on the fly" (depending on what you input into the "Target Settings" fields). Just different ways to accomplish the same thing I guess (as opposed to creating separate individual-speaker curves with Jazzis spreadsheet)?

    I find it very interesting to hear how other people do things. :-)
    I've also experienced the 6db summing in the midbass region and 3db summing in the upper midrange/treble. I think it's due to the wavelengths being so much shorter and being much more susceptible to not being perfect phase at certain frequencies. However, attempting to "fix" the L+R summed response by cutting the midbass back down to the target, or boosting the treble backup completely throws off the tonal balance and it becomes way too bright/harsh. Maybe this is another case where our ears perceive the sum differently than the RTA does. I measure the left side and right side separately and match them to the same target curve. Then I do tonality edits by applying the same filters to both sides equally.

  10. Back To Top    #30

    Re: The "Share your tune measurements and methods" thread

    Quote Originally Posted by mattkim1337 View Post
    I've also experienced the 6db summing in the midbass region and 3db summing in the upper midrange/treble. I think it's due to the wavelengths being so much shorter and being much more susceptible to not being perfect phase at certain frequencies. However, attempting to "fix" the L+R summed response by cutting the midbass back down to the target, or boosting the treble backup completely throws off the tonal balance and it becomes way too bright/harsh. Maybe this is another case where our ears perceive the sum differently than the RTA does. I measure the left side and right side separately and match them to the same target curve. Then I do tonality edits by applying the same filters to both sides equally.
    Ok, thanks for replying with that. I was assuming that I couldn't be the only one that has seen this - but I haven't seen any actual data from anyone else. Hopefully, others will eventually post their measurements for comparison as well. I will be posting more measurements shortly as well.

    Did you also notice any phase and/or reflection-related issues when playing L+R speaker pairs? For example, my left dash and right dash measurements would be spot-on (to my curve), but when I played both left and right dash speakers together, the result was no longer "spot-on" with my curve (due to phase and/or reflection issues) - i would have some wide, shallow dips at certain areas. :-)

    Obviously, your ears are the ultimate "measurement" - but you never know - you may be able to improve things even further if you can identify and fix ever more issues. "You don't know what you don't know" type of thing. :-) Which is the whole point of this thread - to look into identifying and resolving some of these issues.

    You can really only get the full picture if you take individual, L+R pair, "all speaker" and even left/right side measurements - and see how they all interact with each other. I've found it pretty interesting how things change when multiple speakers are playing (vs just measuring individual speakers or "just left" / "just right" measurements). Another example - my left and right midbass speaker measurements will be perfect individually, but when played together, I get a very narrow 7dB dip at 421hz (which I honestly just ignore in this case - at least so far). :-) Also, 1/3rd smoothing really won't show that narrow dip, but no smoothing will show it very obviously.

    Obviously, another question is whether or not you can actually hear a lot of these "issues". Although, to me, I just figure that if I can fix them, then why not?

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