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Thread: my 2012 mk6 gti build

  1. Back To Top    #51
    Senior Member chithead's Avatar
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    Re: my 2012 mk6 gti build

    This is a great article explaining typical power requirements for each speaker:

    Pink Noise, White Noise and Why Your Tweeters Never Get 150 Watts
    "Pushy" has a completely different definition when Sean Connery says it.

  2. Back To Top    #52

    Re: my 2012 mk6 gti build

    i could have done a few of the 4ch amps+sub amps or 5ch amps+sub amps. the 6ch amplifiers providing a lot of power, flexibility, and are the same chassis as the sub amps. this satisfied a symmetry OCD as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by BenevolentDictator View Post
    Nate
    nick

    Quote Originally Posted by BenevolentDictator View Post
    Basically I'm asking if you're legit running a full 700 watts ( I presume 350 a piece?) to your midbasses and they have been taking it without issue?
    nah, 700w each. no problems.

    Quote Originally Posted by BenevolentDictator View Post
    Also, how much are you running to your tweeters?
    stereo channels off the amps, so like 150w each - https://www.arcaudio.com/store?p=107112

    Quote Originally Posted by BigAl205 View Post
    It's a common misconception that an amp is putting out full power all the time.
    yeah, i chose it for dynamics and micro details at all volume levels. combined with enough input voltage, there's a more proper amount of pressure on my eardrums. instruments sound more natural. attack and decay are better.

    these amps will produce full power with like 3.75vrms in. dsp puts out 8vrms as well. -5db test tones for setting gains, i can measure clipping output around 3.7vrms input. they'll put out max power with gains at minimum but gains are like 1/8 to 1/4 up. dsp output channels are -10db for midbasses, -6db for midranges, -3db for tweeters, and 0db for subs (not accounting for near-side lower levels). there's more to this near the end.

    most recordings, i can do 80-90db around 30-50% radio volume. 60-75% for 110db w/ 115db dynamics.

    part of the gain structure also has to do w/ the meca competition cd/content and the scoresheet. the content's got quite a bit of dynamic range, so the recordings seem quiet (except for the dynamic bits). with meca content, the radio volume is 60-75% for 80-90db. linearity tests can go to 100% radio volume for 110-115db.

    for the meca score sheet, to score 9/10-10/10 in a tonality category, you need to be able to hit 115db dynamics and remain composed/balanced. for the Drum Improvisation (it's compressed to hell on youtube but https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93u5XIFblGU ) track, it's 100% radio volume, but it does hit 115db dynamics.

    i analyzed and uploaded the meca CD awhile ago - http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/153763

    i did the iasca 2016 disc too, which always felt flat (and you can see it in the dynamic range scores) - http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/153762

    when i first got it back from JT and started tuning with it, subs sound fine at like 80-90db but way too much at 105db. so this led me to playing w/ levels and gain structure to get it balanced while still maintaining 20hz extension.

    getting gain structures optimized for these constraints takes time. getting the gains balanced between all the speakers for linearity is tough. i've sat in many cars where you get on it and the subs don't keep up or the subs run away and overpower the rest of the sound. or tweeters become way too powerful and unbalanced. or the midrange speakers sound distorted while everything else sounds fine. i've sat in many cars that barely hit 95db dynamics w/ the meca content

    it's certainly not a typical setup, your mileage may vary

  3. Back To Top    #53

    Re: my 2012 mk6 gti build

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris12 View Post
    I’m assuming tuning and modeling make all this big power work, especially when you’re giving 1100watts to each of those subs.
    they want 600w rms, 1200w max. friends recommended like 1000w and 1.2cu each.

    https://www.illusionaudio-america.co...carbon-c12-xl/

    the x2 650.1 didn't seem like it'd be enough power.

    i made some cardboard cutouts to plan this upgrade in fall 2018. the longer 1100.1/1200.6 chassis made more sense than smaller amplifiers in the space i had. also, it simplified power distribution in this small car.

  4. Back To Top    #54
    Noob BenevolentDictator's Avatar
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    Re: my 2012 mk6 gti build

    Quote Originally Posted by nadams5755 View Post
    i could have done a few of the 4ch amps+sub amps or 5ch amps+sub amps. the 6ch amplifiers providing a lot of power, flexibility, and are the same chassis as the sub amps. this satisfied a symmetry OCD as well.

    nick

    nah, 700w each. no problems.


    stereo channels off the amps, so like 150w each - https://www.arcaudio.com/store?p=107112


    yeah, i chose it for dynamics and micro details at all volume levels. combined with enough input voltage, there's a more proper amount of pressure on my eardrums. instruments sound more natural. attack and decay are better.

    these amps will produce full power with like 3.75vrms in. dsp puts out 8vrms as well. -5db test tones for setting gains, i can measure clipping output around 3.7vrms input. they'll put out max power with gains at minimum but gains are like 1/8 to 1/4 up. dsp output channels are -10db for midbasses, -6db for midranges, -3db for tweeters, and 0db for subs (not accounting for near-side lower levels). there's more to this near the end.

    most recordings, i can do 80-90db around 30-50% radio volume. 60-75% for 110db w/ 115db dynamics.

    part of the gain structure also has to do w/ the meca competition cd/content and the scoresheet. the content's got quite a bit of dynamic range, so the recordings seem quiet (except for the dynamic bits). with meca content, the radio volume is 60-75% for 80-90db. linearity tests can go to 100% radio volume for 110-115db.

    for the meca score sheet, to score 9/10-10/10 in a tonality category, you need to be able to hit 115db dynamics and remain composed/balanced. for the Drum Improvisation (it's compressed to hell on youtube but https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93u5XIFblGU ) track, it's 100% radio volume, but it does hit 115db dynamics.

    i analyzed and uploaded the meca CD awhile ago - http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/153763

    i did the iasca 2016 disc too, which always felt flat (and you can see it in the dynamic range scores) - http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/153762

    when i first got it back from JT and started tuning with it, subs sound fine at like 80-90db but way too much at 105db. so this led me to playing w/ levels and gain structure to get it balanced while still maintaining 20hz extension.

    getting gain structures optimized for these constraints takes time. getting the gains balanced between all the speakers for linearity is tough. i've sat in many cars where you get on it and the subs don't keep up or the subs run away and overpower the rest of the sound. or tweeters become way too powerful and unbalanced. or the midrange speakers sound distorted while everything else sounds fine. i've sat in many cars that barely hit 95db dynamics w/ the meca content

    it's certainly not a typical setup, your mileage may vary
    Ffffuuuccckk mmmeeee, I apologize Nick. Typing too fast at work i didn't even register the flub.
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  5. Back To Top    #55

    Re: my 2012 mk6 gti build

    no worries

  6. Back To Top    #56
    Owner BigAl205's Avatar
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    Re: my 2012 mk6 gti build

    I thought it was Nada

  7. Back To Top    #57
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    Re: my 2012 mk6 gti build

    I've always wondered why you had so much hate for the Helix controller. Then I re-read this thread and saw your pics with the knob in the glovebox.
    My Helix knob will randomly pop off every few months or so (and usually hide in between the seat and center console or under the seat). I almost never touch the thing.
    Is that why? Or does it at least contribute?

    I'm picking up some gear for a new build, and we had an extra X2 600.4 shroud lying around, so I was thinking I'd be original-ish and hide my non-Arc processor under it to match the X2 1200.6 I'll be running. Then when I came over to your build thread to look at your use of melamine foam, I see it wasn't so original-ish. I'm betting I saw this before and it was a sub-concious thing, I'm probably going to steal the idea, anyway. lol

    How thick was the foam you used? I see a lot of 1/2" and I see it's also available in 1". I forget why you said you used it, was it to keep the headliner and stuff from vibrating?

    Thanks. It's been a while since I've done a "from-scratch" build, and I'm excited...so I'm brushing up.

    Jay

  8. Back To Top    #58

    Re: my 2012 mk6 gti build

    most of my hate came from using it every day as volume control and the remediation (set screw) would only work for a short time.

    i used megazorbe from secondskin, which i think is 1/2" also adhesive-backed which is nice. https://www.secondskinaudio.com/soun...ega-zorbe-foam

    i couldn't imagine trying to squeeze 1" above the headliner.

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