Sharing my tune for feedback: GB60, GB25, GB10. DSP408

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jtrosky

Were they all taken at the same volume level? Just curious why the level isn't any higher on the "both" measurement (unless you took the combined measurement at a lower volume level?)...

I just want to make sure that you are getting proper summation when both L+R are playing together. I would expect the L+R combined measurement to be 4dB to 6dB higher than the individual measurements.

---

I didnt know that. Thank you! Will definitely keep it uniform now. I think it was lower. I was too lazy to put my ear plugs in. Im really careful with my hearing I vacuum with ear plugs in haa

One weird issue I hear is at a certain frequency in the music (havent nailed it down with pn yet) I get a smeared sound from the left midrange that distorts and blurs across the soundstage. Upper midrange. Planning to use a freq gen and see what freq it is. Maybe I can use narrow band pn to eq it out?

It pinpoints right at the speaker.

If I got a fiio, a DSP with dig in, do you all think it would be noticeable improvement? The idea of my phone doing DA conversion into the HU then the dsp doing AD then DA out to the amps seems like a lot of conversion and potential for error to be introduced. But that is a $1k+ expense I prob wont hear the difference in a car.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Julian

I didnt know that. Thank you! Will definitely keep it uniform now. I think it was lower. I was too lazy to put my ear plugs in. Im really careful with my hearing I vacuum with ear plugs in haa

One weird issue I hear is at a certain frequency in the music (havent nailed it down with pn yet) I get a smeared sound from the left midrange that distorts and blurs across the soundstage. Upper midrange. Planning to use a freq gen and see what freq it is. Maybe I can use narrow band pn to eq it out?

It pinpoints right at the speaker.

---

Also - just a heads-up - look into the "Overlays" screen in REW. Not only can you view multiple measurements on the same screen (which is good for seeing how close left/right is - and how much summation you are getting with L+R combined measurements), but the "Predicted" tab will also show you what any of the EQ filters you have defined in REW will do to the response. It's great for EQ'ing and seeing what the results will be before even re-measuring the system. The Overlays->Predicted window was a game-changer for when once I finally found it. :-)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Julian

I didnt know that. Thank you! Will definitely keep it uniform now. I think it was lower. I was too lazy to put my ear plugs in. Im really careful with my hearing I vacuum with ear plugs in haa

One weird issue I hear is at a certain frequency in the music (havent nailed it down with pn yet) I get a smeared sound from the left midrange that distorts and blurs across the soundstage. Upper midrange. Planning to use a freq gen and see what freq it is. Maybe I can use narrow band pn to eq it out?

It pinpoints right at the speaker.

---

Having a certain frequency range that doesn't behave is not uncommon. Sometimes there is nothing I can do about it. Sometimes I try isolating the frequencies as narrow as I can using a tone generator like you mention, then I'll cut those narrow range of frequencies until it is less distracting. Sometimes the is drastic. Sometimes the cut will create an imbalance elsewhere so it's a balancing act. I don't know of a solid perfect solution for such a thing. My best guess is these are geometry related such as the perfect storm of reflections off the steering wheel and gauge cluster, or something.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Julian

If I got a fiio, a DSP with dig in, do you all think it would be noticeable improvement? The idea of my phone doing DA conversion into the HU then the dsp doing AD then DA out to the amps seems like a lot of conversion and potential for error to be introduced. But that is a $1k+ expense I prob wont hear the difference in a car.

---

Please don't worry about the number of a/d/a conversions. There are more conversions in the music recording and production process than we would believe, so adding a few more will not be a problem unless your gear is very seriously junk.

For getting sounds out of a phone and into a radio, and other user here (cutaway) has done a lot of research on it. You might want to ask him.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jrwalte

I feel over time, my total output keeps going down

---

Same. I am just now getting into the DSP game. Though, im not going to boost any. Ive set all my gains using 0dB tones, because my amp is 100w onto a 60w speaker(components passive). to align to my target curve, im having to do cuts as significant as -18dB(IIRC). This is definitely why I'm losing lots of output. This a result of bad speakers? The amp has a f'd up frequency response? JBL GTR-102

Doors are deadened and mostly sealed

Here is an example of my right components(passive) initial measurement https://imgur.com/a/HUOGCOt

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by test13371997

Same. I am just now getting into the DSP game. Though, im not going to boost any. Ive set all my gains using 0dB tones, because my amp is 100w onto a 60w speaker(components passive). to align to my target curve, im having to do cuts as significant as -18dB(IIRC). This is definitely why I'm losing lots of output. This a result of bad speakers? The amp has a f'd up frequency response? JBL GTR-102

Doors are deadened and mostly sealed

Here is an example of my right components(passive) initial measurement https://imgur.com/a/HUOGCOt

---

Don't be so afraid to boost. You could easily get that response 5dB-10dB higher with relatively minor boosts in that one area. Especially since you set your gains with 0dB tones. I do the same, but I'll boost up to ~5dB if needed and still have never clipped anything, even at higher volumes. Hardly any music is actually recorded at 0dB - you have some headroom to play with.

Also - you are concerned with the "net" boost. I may have multiple PEQ bands boosted 6dB, but the net boost is still very low (or even negative), because some of my other parametric EQ bands have deep cuts that impact frequencies around them - which means a 6dB boost could really be a cut in the "net" response.

That sounds confusing, but if using parametric EQ, you can use boosts on certain bands while still not actually boosting the "net" signal at all.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jtrosky

Don't be so afraid to boost. You could easily get that response 5dB-10dB higher with relatively minor boosts in that one area. Especially since you set your gains with 0dB tones. I do the same, but I'll boost up to ~5dB if needed and still have never clipped anything, even at higher volumes. Hardly any music is actually recorded at 0dB - you have some headroom to play with.

Also - you are concerned with the "net" boost. I may have multiple PEQ bands boosted 6dB, but the net boost is still very low (or even negative), because some of my other parametric EQ bands have deep cuts that impact frequencies around them - which means a 6dB boost could really be a cut in the "net" response.

That sounds confusing, but if using parametric EQ, you can use boosts on certain bands while still not actually boosting the "net" signal at all.

---

I am using boosts on individual PEQ bands, but I am keeping the "net" at 0dB or below. I only set the amp gains with 0dB because the amp is rated 100w while my spkrs are 60w. So its essentially a -3dB overlap.

Here is another picture, different numbers, but same point i am trying to make. net EQ, drastic cuts needed, losing overall output - Imgur

This example is with some boosts, but the net is 0dB and lower. Never possible to introduce clipping this way.

Im just saying that I still think that you are being too "conservative". Amps and speakers can handle "bursts" higher than their "rms" ratings. I'd be little to bet that you could bring your curve at *least* 5dB higher and still never clip anything or overpower your speakers.

However, if the system gets as loud as you want/need it to, then leave it be - but if you find yourself wishing that it was louder at times, I wouldn't hesitate to boost things more - especially if you have quality amps/speakers. There is really only one area that is really low (~400hz-500hz) - you could have a net boost in that area in order to bring the entire response up at least 5dB.

With that logic, my peerless sls 6.5" speakers rated at 75w rms would die on my 180w rms amp.

But that isn't really how these things work. These speakers will never get 180w rms with how music works and my volume is never maxed out.

I checked many songs and the highest energy was usually between 20-80hz and the highest peak was around -3db. No song is really mastered at 0db. Most woofers are also crossed at 80hz so this already cuts frequencies down a few db, on top of everything else.


Now, as long as you are not clipping your source outputs, dsp inputs. dsp outputs, and amp inputs, you should be good on power. And as Jtrosky said, if it gets loud enough for you, none of this even matters.