1 Attachment(s)
Re: Got a somewhat crazy idea for my truck, you tell me what you think.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
geolemon
....
Yep, that's exactly the right range - two comments/questions:
Why do you say this - and even the eight inch version (that's what made my eyebrows raise) - wouldn't be a good choice for midbass? Granted, I haven't checked out the spec sheet yet - but we're basically looking for something that has equivalent-or-better midbass than a typical component set 6.5, since that's exactly what this will be augmenting. It doesn't need to be a subwoofer. But if it starts rolling off at 300hz on the low end, then yeah - that wouldn't be great. I'd really be shocked if that was the case though. Is it? Do you know the Fs? I think I need the spec sheet on this guy...
Also, you probably haven't looked - but there aren't that many 4-ohm DVC 6.5's out there. At a glance, I was impressed at what they found - the RF and the SI. I'd been finding Boss and Pyle. :lol: Any suggestions for one?
Honestly, since we don't need much power handling, and since we really don't even need to care that much about fidelity in that midbass region, and don't need big Xmax like a subwoofer, I was even thinking some turd like a Boss or Pyle might even be just fine for this, provided the Fs was low enough. And if that sucked - little lost, can always replace it with a better one.
But yeah - I'd be pissed if I spent $80 on a throwaway 6.5. So definitely interested to hear your thoughts, and thanks.
EDIT: Never mind... I looked for the specs myself, and see this is NOT a dual voice coil 6.5. We need that, so we can run it "stereo", if you will.
In case you're curious/interested...
What I meant was that the 6.5" driver the OP posted (the PPS4-6) would be poorly suited for 80 - 300 Hz duty, based on my experience with its very similar big brother, the 8" PPS4-8 ...which does indeed roll off ~300 Hz, with an F3 of 179 Hz in an appropriately sized sealed enclosure of 0.138 ft^3 at 0.740 Qtc:
Attachment 11730
Spec sheet for the 6.5, 8 and 10 inch versions of this driver:
https://www.rockfordfosgate.com/rfte...e_rev2-man.pdf
FWIW, having followed this thread closely enough, I too was surprised that the OP had posted this 6.5" SVC SPL "midrange" driver instead of a 6.5" DVC subwoofer as suggested. While I found it quite easy to understand your posts and suggestions in this thread, I'm not at all sure of the OP's goals or level of understanding.
It's not often that I have even the slightest bit of pertinent experience with which to chime in, so when I saw the PPS4-6 I pulled the trigger ...or maybe jumped the gun.
Re: Got a somewhat crazy idea for my truck, you tell me what you think.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Grinder
In case you're curious/interested...
What I meant was that the 6.5" driver the OP posted (the PPS4-6) would be poorly suited for 80 - 300 Hz duty, based on my experience with its very similar big brother, the 8" PPS4-8 ...which does indeed roll off ~300 Hz, with an F3 of 179 Hz in an appropriately sized sealed enclosure of 0.138 ft^3 at 0.740 Qtc:
Attachment 11730
Spec sheet for the 6.5, 8 and 10 inch versions of this driver:
https://www.rockfordfosgate.com/rfte...e_rev2-man.pdf
FWIW, having followed this thread closely enough, I too was surprised that the OP had posted this 6.5" SVC SPL "midrange" driver instead of a 6.5" DVC subwoofer as suggested. While I found it quite easy to understand your posts and suggestions in this thread, I'm not at all sure of the OP's goals or level of understanding.
It's not often that I have even the slightest bit of pertinent experience with which to chime in, so when I saw the PPS4-6 I pulled the trigger ...or maybe jumped the gun.
Spot on - yeah, it's rolling off before 300, so probably not ideal. Maybe with the boost we get from cabin gain it wouldn't be too bad, but it's a SVC not a DVC so not even worth discussing.
For sure, you are totally right.
I'm thinking - in the realm of "6.5's that are DVC", pretty much all the options are most likely going to be designed to be a tiny subwoofer, so it would probably have a low enough Fs to avoid this problem. And even if that swallows up more space in whatever tiny enclosure than would be "ideal" for that 6.5" sub, it should be OK for the output needs for midbass.
The bullet phase-plug should have been a clue to me - midbass drivers don't need those. That's all about making a speaker stretch to play higher frequencies than it's diameter should allow it to play.
Re: Got a somewhat crazy idea for my truck, you tell me what you think.
Might this 6.5" 4 ohm (also available in 2 ohm) DVC sub (from that company that shall not be named) be worth a look? :fear:
https://www.skaraudio.com/collection...nt=18454532929
Re: Got a somewhat crazy idea for my truck, you tell me what you think.
So to clarify Geo, I hope this explains it. The amp is 2 ohm stable all the way around. I'm going to use the sub channel at 2 ohms, the rest of the channels I'm going to run at 4 ohm because all the internals, that is components and coaxes for rear fill are 4 ohms. So if I were to get a midbass I would need it to be 4 ohms to wire in line, hence the SVC. I didn't know anything about the RF, I was just looking and thought that would do what was needed, I don't know anything about midbass or midrange drivers so that's why I need your help choosing, keeping the price between $70-$100. I can only use a 6.5" because if the factory mounting and the enclosure that's already there. I'll make something if I have to in order adapt it like a plate or whatever. I hope that does it for you Geo, clear as mud huh...lol This is why I thought about piggy backing off the sub channel cause I didn't know this was even a thing, midbass that is. So then I'll ask, trying not to confuse. Can I use a SVC 4 ohm midbass speaker for this application? Being a novice at this, I sincerely appreciate all the wealth of knowledge I've gained, sorry for the confusion or if I'm not stating what I want to do correctly. I just had the idea of utilizing the OEM subwoofer enclosure to bring some bass up front instead of just having it all in a box under the rear seat, does that help?
Re: Got a somewhat crazy idea for my truck, you tell me what you think.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mikeyt
So to clarify Geo, I hope this explains it. The amp is 2 ohm stable all the way around. I'm going to use the sub channel at 2 ohms, the rest of the channels I'm going to run at 4 ohm because all the internals, that is components and coaxes for rear fill are 4 ohms. So if I were to get a midbass I would need it to be 4 ohms to wire in line, hence the SVC. I didn't know anything about the RF, I was just looking and thought that would do what was needed, I don't know anything about midbass or midrange drivers so that's why I need your help choosing, keeping the price between $70-$100. I can only use a 6.5" because if the factory mounting and the enclosure that's already there. I'll make something if I have to in order adapt it like a plate or whatever. I hope that does it for you Geo, clear as mud huh...lol This is why I thought about piggy backing off the sub channel cause I didn't know this was even a thing, midbass that is. So then I'll ask, trying not to confuse. Can I use a SVC 4 ohm midbass speaker for this application? Being a novice at this, I sincerely appreciate all the wealth of knowledge I've gained, sorry for the confusion or if I'm not stating what I want to do correctly. I just had the idea of utilizing the OEM subwoofer enclosure to bring some bass up front instead of just having it all in a box under the rear seat, does that help?
It seems you're essentially right back where you started with post #1 of this thread, the main difference being to add a 6.5" midbass driver instead of a 6.5" subwoofer. Trouble is (among a number of issues already addressed by others in this thread), you won't get midbass response from a midbass driver that's fed subwoofer signal - presuming you intend to connect the midbass driver to the subwoofer channel along with your sub(s).
Re: Got a somewhat crazy idea for my truck, you tell me what you think.
I was just restating what I was trying to originally say in case through this it got lost. Using the sub channel was something I thought I could do, had no idea I couldn't. Just thought I could run that distribution block for a third mini sub for up front and all would be well. Then when Geo said not gonna happen and said hey think about the midbass thing, I was like okay, but not sure how to do any of that, really adding one speaker between two channels using an inductive crossover coil, never knew such a thing existed and how it works and what it does. Also thinking since my components are 4 ohms, how do I keep this midbass at 4 ohms as well? I understand you guys are trying to help me and I sooooo appreciate it, and I must apologize if I am frustrating the hell out of some, I'm learning and trying to understand how this all goes together, this is new territory trying to do this, and I know it's simple, just adding a speaker right...lol Hooking the other stuff up is easy, this is a challenge that I've not taken on yet. Not knowing all of this was involved even though it's not a lot to many of you. But to me it's new parts, terminology, what speaker to chose when I've never used anything like this. I know what I want to do (bring the bass upfront and utilize the OEM enclosure), I have an idea or thought I did on how to do it (I learned that's not going to happen), now I have to learn what parts I need or type of parts, how to wire it so it's 4 ohm, and what would be the best recommendation of speaker given $100 as max price. Easy right????
Re: Got a somewhat crazy idea for my truck, you tell me what you think.
Would this work?
CL-6E - CDT Audio Classic Series 6.5" Mid Range Drivers
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Midbass drivers, featuring our compound curvature, carbon treated cones for "Contoured Dispersion." Stainless steel top and bottom plate for heat dissipation. Gold plated terminals. Real butyl rubber surrounds and flat spiders for linear cone excursion.
CDT designs and builds its drivers and crossovers to the very highest of standards. Years of experience and design flexibility yield higher quality and better performance. Quite simply, we produce "audiophile" sound, smoother response, wider dynamic range, and better imaging and sound staging. Our incredible midbass and midrange drivers are flat to 6 kHz! That's 6 octaves response! This puts much less stress on the tweeter, providing better power handling and much better sound. Our special "Contoured Dispersion" radiation pattern in the critical midrange frequencies delivers rock solid imaging and front staging, with virtually no side biasing. These carbon treated cones are smooth and natural sounding thanks to an ideal combination of stiffness and damping. The compound curvature shape prevents cone flex and break-up. This provides clean midbass, even at higher levels. The critical midrange frequencies are clear and precise with no distortion from "ringing." The mids use a real butyl rubber surround, not merely a mixed butyl compound.
- Diameter: 6.5" (170mm)
- Sensitivity: 90.8 dB
- Power Handling: 80 Wrms (100W pk)
- Frequency Response: 60 ~ 5000 hZ
- Nominal Impedance: 4 Ohms
- Voice Coil Diameter: 1.0" (26mm)
Dimensions
- Mounting depth: 2.63" (66.8 mm)
- Cutout diameter: 5.78" (147 mm)
- Outer diameter: 6.63" (168 mm)
Thiele-Small Paramters
- Free Air Resonance: 67.4 Hz
- Voice Coil DC Resistance: 3.59 ohms
- Voice Coil Inductance @ 1 kHz: 0.19 mH
- Mechanical Q (Qms): 3.56
- Electrical Q (Qes): 1.08
- Total Q (Qts): 0.83
- Compliance Volume (Vas): 8.73l / 0.308 ft3
- Moving mass, Diaphragm: 15.81 Gr
- Driver Radiating Area (Sd): 133 cM2 / 20.57 In2
- Motor Force Factor: 4.71 Tm
Note:
All sealed boxes greater than 0.6 cubic feet are
useable but the response effects will suit
special purposes. Usably small enclosure setup
for bass in a medium size cab is shown here.
Re: Got a somewhat crazy idea for my truck, you tell me what you think.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mikeyt
So to clarify Geo, I hope this explains it. The amp is 2 ohm stable all the way around. I'm going to use the sub channel at 2 ohms, the rest of the channels I'm going to run at 4 ohm because all the internals, that is components and coaxes for rear fill are 4 ohms. So if I were to get a midbass I would need it to be 4 ohms to wire in line, hence the SVC. I didn't know anything about the RF, I was just looking and thought that would do what was needed, I don't know anything about midbass or midrange drivers so that's why I need your help choosing, keeping the price between $70-$100. I can only use a 6.5" because if the factory mounting and the enclosure that's already there. I'll make something if I have to in order adapt it like a plate or whatever. I hope that does it for you Geo, clear as mud huh...lol This is why I thought about piggy backing off the sub channel cause I didn't know this was even a thing, midbass that is. So then I'll ask, trying not to confuse. Can I use a SVC 4 ohm midbass speaker for this application? Being a novice at this, I sincerely appreciate all the wealth of knowledge I've gained, sorry for the confusion or if I'm not stating what I want to do correctly. I just had the idea of utilizing the OEM subwoofer enclosure to bring some bass up front instead of just having it all in a box under the rear seat, does that help?
Right - and what YOU are describing won't work. So let me clarify my ORIGINAL response:
1) That won't work. Forget about it.
2) BUT - if you are dying to use that 6.5 location, here's an idea that's COMPLETELY DIFFERENT that WILL work - and better yet, work where your system may need support (midbass) rather than where it not only won't need it, but might hurt it (subwoofer).
Now go back and read my original responses back there.
I'm talking about your sub channel running just your subs.
Your rear channels running just your rears.
Your front channels is what I'm talking about. I drew a diagram. Look at it-
Rather than your front channels running just your front components, you'll have the amp powering a DVC 6.5 as well - with some simple coils filtering off the highs.
So on THOSE two channels, the amp will run at 2 ohms from 80hz (or wherever you have it set) to 300hz.
From that point up - the amp only sees the components.
The power going to the components doesn't change.
The only difference is - you have a third 6.5 getting power as well. Making midbass.. And that's why it needs to be a DVC.
Sent from my LM-G710 using Tapatalk
Re: Got a somewhat crazy idea for my truck, you tell me what you think.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
geolemon
Right - and what YOU are describing won't work. So let me clarify my ORIGINAL response:
1) That won't work. Forget about it.
2) BUT - if you are dying to use that 6.5 location, here's an idea that's COMPLETELY DIFFERENT that WILL work - and better yet, work where your system may need support (midbass) rather than where it not only won't need it, but might hurt it (subwoofer).
Now go back and read my original responses back there.
I'm talking about your sub channel running just your subs.
Your rear channels running just your rears.
Your front channels is what I'm talking about. I drew a diagram. Look at it-
Rather than your front channels running just your front components, you'll have the amp powering a DVC 6.5 as well - with some simple coils filtering off the highs.
So on THOSE two channels, the amp will run at 2 ohms from 80hz (or wherever you have it set) to 300hz.
From that point up - the amp only sees the components.
The power going to the components doesn't change.
The only difference is - you have a third 6.5 getting power as well. Making midbass.. And that's why it needs to be a DVC.
Sent from my LM-G710 using Tapatalk
Good stuff. I wish I were as patient.
I hadn't thought of sensitivity until now, which leaves me wondering if it's even plausible that a suitable 6.5" DVC driver might exist, i.e. one with high enough sensitivity to effectively blend with component sensitivity of (presumably) ~90 dB. For example, the 6.5" DVC subwoofer I linked in post # 23 is rated at just 82.8 dB sensitivity, which I suspect is typical of such a driver. Would such a disparity not require an L-pad or some other means of attenuating the components? Am I missing something?
Re: Got a somewhat crazy idea for my truck, you tell me what you think.
Here's another example of a 6.5" 4 ohm DVC sub that seems to my inexperienced eye like it might be well suited to this application if it weren't for its low sensitivity (81.5 dB).
https://www.woofersetc.com/sundown-a...subwoofer.html
