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2019 Honda Civic Hatchback Sport
Finally remembered to bring my build log over from DIYMA. May take me a little bit to get it all transferred but here we go.
The Car:
After owning my previous car, a 2006 Civic Sedan LX, for 13 years and putting just over 250k miles on it, I finally upgraded. Yea!
(link to old build log here)
The new car is a 2019 Honda Civic Hatchback Sport (non-touring edition). I looked at and test drove quite a few cars. I really liked a couple but ultimately landed on this Civic for the following reasons:
- I like hatchbacks. And, they are just easier to get bass right in, IME.
- The gas mileage. I drive 80 miles round trip each day.
- We already own a 2018 CR-V so I didn't really need a larger car for family stuff. I just need a good car that has a decent platform for aftermarket audio, enough space for me and my family to make quick trips around town, and something I could see myself still driving 10 years from now.
- I think it looks pretty sharp.
- It’s a budget friendly vehicle and leaves me enough money to cover the audio stuff.
- It's fun to drive. It isn’t the world's fastest car but you have to remember I'm coming from a 2006 civic with 250k miles on it. So, this thing is almost like a race car to me. It's got some nice speed, takes corners like a champ... I won't be driving it like a madman but just being able to finally merge without fearing my engine is going to fall out from the workload it's under is a big improvement. :D
Here’s some pictures of the car the day I got it:
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Re: 2019 Honda Civic Hatchback Sport
Audio and Install Goals:
The goal for this system is pretty simple: a relatively stock appearance.
Before I get too far in to the details, let me give some perspective here…
I’ve been around this hobby for a good while. I’ve had a very “extreme” build for a long time and I’ve had a system that sounds quite good and gets stupid loud, if I say so myself. I’ve also seen and heard many incredible vehicles running the gamut from extreme to rather stock installs. Some installs are easier to tune “out of the box” than others. Some offer things others can’t. But, for the most part, what I’ve experienced is that there has really never been a single defining characteristic to what makes one system sound fantastic other than a) a good install, b) an understanding of the equipment and limitations/implications of the gear/install and c) a good tune based on a & b.
When I think back to my favorite car audio systems as a whole package (sound + aesthetic), the cars that come to mind for me are: Kirk Proffitt’s Acura TL, Jason Bertholomey’s BRZ and Michael Myers' Scion. None have "extreme" builds. Myers has dash pods but it's nothing crazy. All have/had door mounted midbass and a (relatively) understated yet elegant install. There’s nothing that stands out, cosmetically, in a way that draws attention to itself. Yet, they all sound incredible. They just have great tonality and an incredibly enjoyable fun factor. It's like you get in and the speakers just get out of the way and you enjoy the system for what it is. I've done the waaaaay extreme thing: 10 inch midbass in the kicks with a 4 inch hole cut in the firewall, and 5 inch coaxials on the dash. And as great as it sounded, if I’m being completely honest with myself, I preferred what those cars had to offer as an overall package. Don’t get me wrong; I loved my old system. And it wasn’t terribly obtrusive, but for me, personally, there’s really something about having a system that sounds fantastic without seeing what you’re hearing. And while I’m at it, let me be clear that I’m not dissing others’ choices of what they do in their systems. I did things in my old civic that I’m sure others wouldn’t have cared for either. I’m just stating my personal likes/dislikes from my previous builds and drawing inspiration from those I have enjoyed that kept a more stock-like appearance up front.
So, with that in mind, I figure why not take some aspects of my favorites and combine it with some of what I’ve learned and use that to build what I like. And the goal with my new car, at least for the foreseeable future, is to try to target a system that has a relatively stock appearance up front and squeeze out all the sound quality I can within those constraints.
I took a short drive up to Audio X in Florence, AL to talk with Steve Cook about my ideas and get his insight on the new car install. Steve and his shop are known literally worldwide for creating some of the best SQ systems in the States and winning multiple championships in SQ comps. Steve also used to compete in SPL and still holds some world records I believe. So, the dude has a proven track record for building incredible systems that can sound loud and good. Years before I purchased this car I was saying I would have Steve and his shop do the work for me on my next car. And that's exactly what I'm doing. :) I could do it myself but frankly, I just don’t want to. I don’t have the time or desire to do this much, especially in this heat. Besides, his shop does better work than I do, for sure. I’ve known Steve for a long time. His work is incredible. With him being an hour from me, it was a no-brainer to have him do this install for me. Plus, the major benefit is I’ll actually have a completed system instead of me having the car apart for a year, slowly getting the install done (I know me, it would take that long, if not longer).
Initially I was thinking of trying to cram a 3 or 4 inch midrange + tweeter in to the sail panel but that wouldn’t work without sticking out like a sore thumb. Something I don’t want. Dash pods are also out because of the obtrusive aesthetic. No kick mounted midbass for now; I have no doubt down the line this will be revisited but that’s just not on the docket at this moment. Ultimately, after some test fitting, research of drivers, and discussion with Steve this is what I decided on:
Equipment list and some rationale:- Kenwood DDX9905S HU: Fine headunit. Comes from my previous car. No need to upgrade.
- MiniDSP C-DSP with Dirac Live: Great results with it in my old car and I want to try it out on the new one.
- ScanSpeak Illuminator D3004/6040-00 Beryllium Dome Tweeters in sail panels: Excellent on/off axis response. Relatively high sensitivity.
- Dyn Esotar2 430 midrange in dash corners: The best pure midrange I’ve ever tested. Excellent linear response through its primary passband and great off-axis response. Small size makes it easy to fit in the “stock” dash corners. “Stock” meaning, there is not an OEM dash/windshield corner location for speakers of any size in this car. So, Steve and I talked about it and the plan was made to pull the windshield and cut in to the dash piece to create a spot for the mids in a sealed enclosure. The location will be made such that future upgrades/swaps (in case something were to blow by accident) can be easily handled without the need to pull the windshield again. The dash piece costs $65 to replace so not a big loss there.
- Audio Frog GB60 midbass in doors: These GB60's have long linear throw, good sensitivity, and nice power handling in a small footprint. Great midbass for door installs.
- JL Audio 12w6v3 – Never heard any complaints or had any complaints with a 12w6. Simple and effective. Also, I can remove it if I need more space for a trip somewhere.
- Tru Technology Tungsten Grande Amplifiers: I'm not too much of an "amp guy". I kind of go with the flow there (no pun intended). My main concern is noise floor and power and reliability; as long as those are adequate I’m good. Having said that, with my new install I wanted to try something new amp-wise. While I was at Cook’s shop, I listened to Scott Brazelton's Lexus and was blown away at how good that system sounded without, literally, any EQ. Dude's running Dyn 430 midranges (which I already wanted) and Tru Tungsten Grande amps. I was sold on the combo. Plus, Steve is a Tru Technology dealer so no worries there if something happened to one of the amps. So, that's what I'll be running now.
- Tru Technology Tungsten Grande TG-RS4 - Tweeters and midranges
- Tru Technology Tungsten Grande TG-RS2 - Midbass
- Tru Technology Tungsten Grande TG-RS2 - Subwoofer
The drivers I'm using are my “dream team” drivers for this kind of install. They're not necessarily cheap but considering the number of times I have “upgraded” my previous car's system over the years, I figure I’ll save money in the long run by getting what I really, really want the first time rather than settle for something that costs less but then feeling the need to replace it with something better later.
Within those confines, Steve and his guys have full reign to do what they need to do to make it work and add some of their own creativity to the install. I'm excited to see what they do with it.
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Speaking of the amps...
I talked to John at Tru earlier and he gave me an update. The TG-RS4 is done and the TG-RS2’s are being built.
And yes, I wanted them in purple. :D
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Re: 2019 Honda Civic Hatchback Sport
Small update on the midrange portion of the build. Steve sent me this picture earlier. The Dyn 430 mounted on the plexi baffle that will be installed in the corners. There’s a lip around the ring for a grille to be installed that will hide the speakers.
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CNC cut baffles with the midranges flush mounted. Precision work!
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Minor update. Trunk work has started. Amps shipped today and should be in by Friday. Still planning for completion before finals.
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John sent me these pics of the finished amps. I can’t wait to see ‘em in person.
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They made one that is bridgeable for me. Was told it puts out about 730 watts but I'm not sure if that was at 2 ohm or not; I assume it was since that was the intended load configuration (John asked what I'd be using and Steve told him make it for a 2 ohm load).
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I asked John Yi (at Tru) if he could provide some words regarding the amps since I've had people ask and I thought who better to ask than the guy who made them. So, here you go:
Quote:
Tungsten & Tungsten Grand v2 Series are designed to be modular.
Meaning multiple configuration.
Tungsten Grande RS is our Top of the Line
Grande RS vs. S (Standard)?
Fifty (50) parts upgraded + Different preamp PCB
Grande RS uses same parts config as our Billet v2 Stage IV & Stage V
Your amp
TG-RS4 was configed to be Hi-Voltage to have much power on tap.
150w x4
As well as removing Bridgeable feature to further streamline signal path
This also goes for your Mid-Bass Amp to streamline signal path.
Your Bass amp, we kept its Bridgeable feature and changed power supply to be Hi-current Mode to support your Sub impedance.
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Some more updates...
Looks like the trunk is closer to completion. Still need to build the raised floor and sub box. But it’s looking awesome to me. The extra battery was Steve’s suggestion but I thought it would be nice so was on board.
The minidsp controller mount was a nice surprise. I told Steve when I dropped the car off to just put it in the glovebox and that would be fine. I also asked if he could find a way to integrate a little mini voltage display I bought years ago. So when he sent the pic of both of them mounted to the console piece I was pleasantly surprised.
And the sails are coming along nicely.
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And here’s some shots of what the underside looks like with the enclosures. Lots of stuff had to be moved from here to make room.
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And in case anyone is wondering, there’s no concern with the midrange reflecting off the grille and causing issues. The distance from the cone to the underside of the grille is about 0.80 inches. That’s about 8.5khz in half-wave calcs. Which is at least twice as high as my intended crossover point.
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Almost forgot, everything is playing now. Still no sub and no windshield so no tuning. But it was nice to power it up and hear everything working. And nice to see the headunit in its new home.
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Here’s a video of the CNC cutting the grille covers
https://youtu.be/LCXnRGWFXtc
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Dash is now done. Steve messaged me last night saying the acrylic he used the other day was too brittle so he re-made the grilles out of ABS this time. I think the ABS actually looks better. Seems to match the vents in the car.
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Well, the windshield is back in. At this point the false floor needs a top and the sub enclosure needs to be built. Then she’ll be done. I’m looking forward to it.
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I also had them tint the windows for me. 35% ceramic all around. Air 80 on the windshield.
I had 20% on my last civic. I didn’t want to go that dark again. The Air 80 is to help block UV and keep the heat down. Makes a big difference.
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Realized I took some pictures of the engine bay wiring and the power supply but forgot to post them. So here we go.
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And also a cool shot of the car I took the other night ...
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Nick took some videos of different system walkthroughs at Finals. Figured I'd share the one we made of mine.
https://youtu.be/iewdbXh7-OU
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Ok. That's it! All caught up now!
Over the winter I'll work on the tune. Plan to overhaul the tune I took to finals (it did OK, but isn't near as good as it can be just yet).
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Awesome. I was gonna ask you how the tune was coming along. How are you liking what Dirac is doing for you?
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I still think that's one of the coolest builds I've seen Steve do. I'm happy for you
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The install was featured in this month's Mobile Electronics Mag. Joey asked me if I'd be interested in writing something up about the install to provide some insights for the mag and highlight the work Steve and his crew put in on this build. So, of course I was happy to oblige.
https://issuu.com/mobileelectronics/...me_december/48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
erinh
The install was featured in this month's Mobile Electronics Mag. Joey asked me if I'd be interested in writing something up about the install to provide some insights for the mag and highlight the work Steve and his crew put in on this build. So, of course I was happy to oblige.
https://issuu.com/mobileelectronics/...me_december/48
Wow, that is soooo cool!! Congratulations on the recognition, it's very well deserved. The installation is absolutely incredible. The article is a good read too.
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Erin in the big boy club now:woohoo:
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Been a while since I've posted here. Nearly 7 months since I started the thread. Oh, that reminds me, I think a few people in this thread owe me some money for their wager that I would change things before 6 months. ;)
Anyway, I've been working on getting my testing going again and have started posting things on YouTube. My video today has some information about how I set up my sub/midbass crossover and thought some of you might be interested in seeing it. Here's a link to the thread I started:
https://www.diymobileaudio.com/threa...idbass.427251/
And here's the post:
In this video I discuss why I recommend using your subwoofer to improve midbass response. Get your pitchforks ready!... I’m suggesting to run your sub higher than 30hz! :D
This isn’t truly a shocking revelation. Plenty of people already do what I suggest. It just goes against intuition and against some beliefs in the car audio community that a subwoofer should not play too high in frequency because it can cause the bass to be localized behind you.
The reason why is due to one MAJOR issue in car audio: the “Nearside Null”. This is the large dip in response of the driver’s side midbass speaker that occurs typically in the 70-90hz region. This doesn't occur in every car; there are certainly exceptions to the more extreme car installs.
It is an acoustical null caused by the relationship of the listener’s location relative to the midbass location and generally caused by the width of the vehicle. If you play a track with bass guitar it’s very prevalent; you get a localization to the nearside midbass speaker when the midbass speaker is crossed lower than the frequency where the null occurs.
Generally speaking, the lower your crossover point between midbass and subwoofer, the more noticeable this occurrence is. Unfortunately, this isn’t something you can simply “EQ out”, either. Throwing +6dB at this null may only result in 1dB of actual gain; that means you’re wasting a LOT of power and risking damage to your speaker for no acoustical gain. Some of you may even think to yourselves “seems like you’re not getting much by crossing the midbass low. Maybe there’s not as much benefit as I thought in doing that”. That’s a logical assumption and a lot of times that’s actually true. Crossing the midbass too low can actually result in more “bass behind you”! And you can also take some of the strain off your midbass by crossing them at or above the null. Ironically, we in car audio tend to cross midbass low to get the “up front” bass we so much desire. BUT, IN FACT, the majority of the time you have bass that pulls to the rear is BECAUSE of the midbass nulls. I know that sounds counteractive. But it’s the truth. Standing waves are problematic and this is one symptom of them; whether in home or car audio.
Contrary to popular belief, raising the subwoofer crossover in to the region that this null occurs can actually HELP the sound to stay focused and achieve “up front” bass. If you can move your subwoofer to a location where it is null-free through a frequency above the Nearside Null then you can likely improve midbass without negatively impacting the “up front bass” effect that so many are after. And you can also take some of the strain off your midbass by crossing them at or above the null frequency. Not all have the luxury of space to move the subwoofer around much but experimentation is key here; you may be surprised at the difference subwoofer placement in the trunk can make.
And one important conclusion here is that placing the rear mounted subwoofer on the opposite side of the listening position often results in better response!
https://youtu.be/aIAV-jDafq0
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Beautiful work of art. Congrats!!! So when is the center channel going in :}.
Ge0