Beware that passive radiators should be mounted vertically to prevent sag, due to their comparatively high mass, depending on the amount of weight added for tuning.
Beware that passive radiators should be mounted vertically to prevent sag, due to their comparatively high mass, depending on the amount of weight added for tuning.
This would be a fun topic for a separate thread.
I believe that's largely one of those "back in the day" myths that perpetuates exclusively because that "...depending on how much weight you add!" has no upper weight limit, so it sounds true.
Back in the day, PRs were just speakers designed to be speakers - they just removed the motors and added mass as desired. Those suspensions often weren't even designed to avoid sag when NOT used as PRs...
I recall in a discussion when Cerwin Vega's Stoker sub was released, how the center adjustment device was really an antique patent, that CV decided to pull out again because the Stroker had such high mass and higher suspension compliance than most SPL subs.
Today though, even the PRs that are still built like "speakers without motors" benefit both from modern materials and a broader range of Cms values available - though I'm sure there's some where this is still true, just like there's still some woofers where this is true.
And the main point really, that I almost forgot to get back to - weight. With most purpose-built PRs today, you wouldn't need to add much, if any weight at all... and even with added mass you've still got a more practical mass-to-compliance ratio.
I'm finally getting around to building my sealed and PR boxes for my JBL GTi 12 and JL W7 12, but I'm likely not going to be able to really try them out for a while.
Here's an interesting look at these PRs though, and their specs. I was intrigued because they seem well built - I love that they come with some mass, and I can actually adjust mass in either direction if needed, based on how they are built.
(Edit: I'll have to try to add other pics another way - Tapatalk app only lets you add 1, so here's the specs)
Edit: added pics -
Last edited by geolemon; 05-04-2020 at 08:32 AM. Reason: Added pics
Scanspeak - Dynaudio - Helix - Bose
I don't want to drag your thread off topic - but I remember some epic forum battles between Matt Overpeck and Dan Wiggins... I'm clearly biased because I am fully "team XBL^2", licensed it in the early 00s myself...
...but always regretted not buying at least one of the Audiomobile 12s to compare them to my other reference subs.
I forget now even if the Audiomobile were long-coil overhung, or short-coil underhung...
Do you recall?
Either way, I recall they were still more linear (cleaner) than the average sub, but still subject to the traditional design trade-offs that XBL^2 aimed to mitigate.
Did you buy them in the Matt Overpeck days ('00s)? Or I see there's been a rebirth again, recently (same with Adire's car branch, interestingly enough )...
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There is currently a factory sub bolted down in this sub-floor. Then of course there is the light weight plastic removable lid. I hear absolutely zero rattle.
I was going to try my baffle idea first. If i need to choke off air space I have ways to do that.
I'm no stranger to fiberglass. I've done my share of enclosures with it. But, will only do here as a last resort. Like you mentioned the stuff is messy. I still have some high quality US Composites stuff laying around if need be.
Ge0
Scanspeak - Dynaudio - Helix - Bose
Info on the Mass 2012-D4: https://www.diymobileaudio.com/threa...s.40638/page-2
I bought this sub years ago before the closure and rebirth of Audiomobile. I remember talking directly to Steve and Thilo about the properties of his sub.
Ge0
Scanspeak - Dynaudio - Helix - Bose
Eclipse 8102 is 5 1/4” mounting depth
Kenwood DDX9903S, Arc PS-8 w/PSC, Arc Audio 1200.6, Helix SPXL1000, Audiofrog GB12D4(2) IB, GB60, GB25, GB10
Holy crap what a trip down memory lane...
I was a moderator at the now defunct CarAudioForum.com around this time. It was a little more enthusiast-friendly back than, but still had lots of deep dives like this one, with less intimidating aggression. I miss that place... But CAJ feels a lot like that did.
I remember lots of those characters and it feels like all that's missing is Dan Wiggins (who did personally supply the Mass 12 for this DUMAX run: https://www.diymobileaudio.com/index.php?posts/475177) and Matt Overpeck himself... Another guy like DS-21 there who had some knowledge but a Sheldon Cooper self image and corresponding levels of tact.
At any rate - even on that thread there's controversy as to whether it was overhung or underhung... You'd probably be able to tell just by looking at your top plate. I swore I remember them being underhung. I own zero underhung subs. :sad:
At any rate, I do remember the suspension argument.
Matt claimed the linear suspension that tapped out at 24mm was both "by design" and "necessary", that it intentionally slowed the speaker over 24mm to avoid crashing (and I feel like I remember him being called out for that because it wouldn't have been the coil that would have struck first, being underhung?) My memory could be totally off, but Dan backed it up with a progressive spider good for about 30mm of linear motion, DUMAX proven - I used the same spider vendor at his recommendation. And that fit standard open market baskets. RE used the same basket, different suspension on the original XXX and got 32mm linear if I recall.
If Matt had just toned down the arrogance and tried a little humility and relating - history might have been different.
I'd still love a MASS 12.
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Scanspeak - Dynaudio - Helix - Bose